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Answeredrobk's MR2 Turbo

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robk
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 15:00:45 (permalink)
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MR2QIK
Why hello there....
http://www.hardtuned.net/..._item&item_id=8823
These can be made to fit without much issue.

Oh ****!! Good find! That's a lot of money but not out of the question by any means.

The rears would probably be fine because they are the same width as what I have now, provided that the offset and spoke cross section are close enough to what I have now, to avoid clearance issues with the calipers or guards.

As for the fronts, well, they are 8.5 wide and my current front wheels are 7.5 wide. I currently have only about 3mm clearance from the coilovers, and my wheels are roughly flush with the outside of the guards, maybe a few mm outside. I'm not sure how much trouble that extra 1 inch of width would cause. EDIT: I forgot to mention I currently have barely 1mm of clearance between my front calipers and spokes, with a small spacer about 3mm thick.
post edited by robk - 2012/06/26 22:19:43

There is an extensive build thread for my car here: http://www.mr2australia.com/mr2play/tm.aspx?m=18316
MR2QIK
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 15:22:08 (permalink)
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Well to be honest, the rears will most likely fit immediately. The fronts will require spacers to clear everything (approx 10mm), but it'll work perfectly with your tyres & guards. It's not absolutely necessary to change alignment afterwards either.
 
Btw, $1200 with free shipping isn't bad @ all (before any negotiation). Those wheels cost a lot more brand new. You could also sell your wheels for approx $400-500, so the changeover price is actually quite low.
 
For reference sake, Bryce runs very aggressive 18x8.5 fronts. Somewhere around +20 to +25 offset with coilovers. I've run 18x8 +30 front without any scrubbing. Dylans gone quite far too.

MR2QIK - "The Little Car That Could"



320rwkw @ 19psi (pump fuel, no giggle gas)
11.96 @ 116mph (with 228rwkw)
robk
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 15:55:28 (permalink)
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MR2QIK
Well to be honest, the rears will most likely fit immediately. The fronts will require spacers to clear everything (approx 10mm), but it'll work perfectly with your tyres & guards. It's not absolutely necessary to change alignment afterwards either.

When you say spacer, in this case I assume you mean an adapter with its own studs? I don't see how there could be enough thread remaining on the normal studs otherwise (depending on the wheel design, but that in turn would affect caliper clearance).
 
MR2QIK
Btw, $1200 with free shipping isn't bad @ all (before any negotiation). Those wheels cost a lot more brand new. You could also sell your wheels for approx $400-500, so the changeover price is actually quite low.

Yeah it's not a bad price.
 
MR2QIK
For reference sake, Bryce runs very aggressive 18x8.5 fronts. Somewhere around +20 to +25 offset with coilovers. I've run 18x8 +30 front without any scrubbing. Dylans gone quite far too.

I know there are plenty of SW20 owners with 8.5 wide rims at the front, but I'm still a bit puzzled.
I just had a look here again:
http://www.rimsntires.com/specs.jsp
I think the 8.5 wide rims in the ad are +53 offset? If so, that would probably push the inside of the rims HEAPS closer to the coilovers?
I better triple check that my existing front rims are definitely 7.5 not 8.5, but I'm pretty sure I've got that right.
 
 
EDIT: what does "CB 60mm" mean BTW?

There is an extensive build thread for my car here: http://www.mr2australia.com/mr2play/tm.aspx?m=18316

MRTurbo
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 16:11:09 (permalink)
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Centre Bore (hole)? That should be perfect for the MR2 hub :)

1990 SW20 GT 3S-GTE Targa
2001 Honda CBR600F4i

robk
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 16:12:46 (permalink)
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Ah yeah that makes sense thanks.

There is an extensive build thread for my car here: http://www.mr2australia.com/mr2play/tm.aspx?m=18316
MR2QIK
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 16:24:50 (permalink)
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Well if it's 53, you'd want an spacer with studs for an extra 15-20mm. Good part is, it probably won't require as much to clear the coilovers. That offset rim probably has a higher disk clearance. I'll double check actually.

MR2QIK - "The Little Car That Could"



320rwkw @ 19psi (pump fuel, no giggle gas)
11.96 @ 116mph (with 228rwkw)

MR2QIK
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 16:39:33 (permalink)
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Can't find the data sheets on these bad boys anymore as they're discontinued. Either way......Temptation.....

MR2QIK - "The Little Car That Could"



320rwkw @ 19psi (pump fuel, no giggle gas)
11.96 @ 116mph (with 228rwkw)
robk
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 18:40:20 (permalink)
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I just did a rough manual measurement of the offset of my front rims, and I think it is about +40. I also confirmed they are definitely 7.5 wide. I think this means that I would require a spacer at least 1 inch thick to use 8.5 rims with a +53 offset...not something I'm comfortable with. Besides, it just occurred to me that, regardless of how I account for the difference in offset, I would always end up with my rims about 1 inch outside the guards, which is too much for my liking. In summary...I don't care what other people have done, I'm not going to consider 8.5 rims as an option at all anymore. Thanks for the link to that ad anyway Jay, I wish the 8.5 rims were 7.5!

There is an extensive build thread for my car here: http://www.mr2australia.com/mr2play/tm.aspx?m=18316
MR2QIK
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/22 23:07:46 (permalink)
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That's actually not correct. With a 15mm spacer it'd sit similar to mine up front.

Your call though.

MR2QIK - "The Little Car That Could"



320rwkw @ 19psi (pump fuel, no giggle gas)
11.96 @ 116mph (with 228rwkw)
robk
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/23 02:39:36 (permalink)
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MR2QIK
With a 15mm spacer it'd sit similar to mine up front.

If coilover clearance (or lack thereof) was disregarded, then yes I agree that would be true...BUT with a spacer of 'only' 15mm, the inside of the those rims would be about 10mm beyond the point of no clearance with the coilovers! That's why I mentioned the need for a spacer about an inch thick just to clear the coilovers.
To clarify my point in another way, the coilover clearance is the main factor that can't really be changed much, and the clearance is already as small as it can go, so any additional tyre width will directly and unavoidably increase the protrusion of the wheel beyond the guard.
I wasn't just guessing numbers when I typed that last post, I did the calcs and thought it through properly!
post edited by robk - 2014/06/18 15:24:21

There is an extensive build thread for my car here: http://www.mr2australia.com/mr2play/tm.aspx?m=18316
robk
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/23 17:53:18 (permalink)
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*EDIT*
Info for future readers of this thread...
Since I originally made this post, I've done some cleaning up of this thread and deleted some posts, therefore some of the following posts will seem out of context unless you read this first...
 
At the time when this post was made, it included some datalogging results for the pre-IC and post-IC air temperatures with my old A2W intercooler setup. At the time, I had 2x PWR heat exchangers in the engine bay (one in the normal A2A location on the right, and another on the top left of the engine bay), with a PWR A2W intercooler barrel in the boot. 
 
Since late 2013, I've had a more typical setup with a front mount heat exchanger and an A2W intercooler core in the engine bay, and it works significantly better than the previous setup described above!
 
See here for updated temperature datalogging results with the old A2W intercooler setup:
http://www.mr2australia.c./mr2play/fb.ashx?m=82596
post edited by robk - 2014/06/18 15:37:20

There is an extensive build thread for my car here: http://www.mr2australia.com/mr2play/tm.aspx?m=18316
cogs
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/23 19:54:45 (permalink)
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Nice work!  I agree with all your points except ...
robk
- It takes about 1 minute for the air temperature after the intercooler to reduce back down (close to) the typical cruise temperature. This time would be reduced if the vehicle speed was higher, increasing the air flow to the heat exchangers. 
 
 
I think what you're seeing here is the effect of the thermal inertia of your sensors.  Even supposed "fast response" sensors exhibit significant inertia, and this is somewhat increased with lower airspeeds.  You'll notice that your pre and post intercooler temps follow an almost identical curve, despite the fact that the intercooler core temperature is remaining stable.  I say this because the core temperature very closely approximates the water temperature due to the huge water/aluminium junction area (very low thermal resistance), thermal conductivity of aluminium and constant water flow.  If the core temperature was increasing significantly you'd see less difference between the in/out temps, and this is not occurring.
 
  Back to the sensor, when the airflow is high (lots of boost and engine speed) it reacts quickly because the sensing element surface is always in contact with air that has not cooled significantly due to the contact with the element.  When airflow is low, a cushioning layer of air forms, increasing the thermal resistance of the air/element boundary in turn increasing its reaction time.  This is why you see the temperature rise quickly but drop more slowly - the sensor is lagging the air temperature at a rate somewhere inversely proportional to flow. 
 
Which brings me to my point.  Better airflow through your heat exchangers won't have any effect on this, because it's not the water that needs to be cooled more quickly - it's remaining cool indicating that the heat exchangers are already working effectively.

1990 SW20 GT
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/23 19:59:16 (permalink)
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What was the temperature there today?
cogs
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/23 23:57:21 (permalink)
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Yes, the temperature decrease, particularly post intercooler, would be almost instant with the coolant and core holding the relatively steady temperature your log shows.  The intercooler works far more effectively at low airflows, this is evident on the parts of the graph where post intercooler temps are only a few degrees above water temp, ie. cruising once thermal inertia effects have subsided.  The pre intercooler temp would reduce more slowly due to heating of the hot pipe, compressor housing, etc. during boost. 
 
The logging you've done doesn't really give much indication how it would perform on the track. Going by the rate of water temperature rise during the two big boost events it might struggle a bit, but as you pointed out more heat exchanger airflow at higher speeds will negate this to some extent.
post edited by cogs - 2012/06/24 00:11:56

1990 SW20 GT
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RE: robk's MR2 Turbo 2012/06/24 02:56:39 (permalink)
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Those graphs are interesting , but my recorded temps are different by a lot ?
 
Will have to get them but when tuning was done we set a lot of alarms. We turned off the intercooler pump to set alarm light based on temp 50 degrees IAT's.
Red lining constantly start /go it reached only 58 degrees thats on a 28 degree day.
Connected the pump and it never went over 38 degrees.
On the 40 degree days the alarm never went off at all but it nudged 49 degrees
 
With cruising this morning intake temp stayed below 28 degrees and peaked at 35 , but recovered very quickly , it was a cold morning.
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