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MR2Vaeth
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2006/04/10 09:40:34 (permalink)
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Vaeth's Rebuild Blog

As most of you might know, I blew my engine about 6 months ago while attending a track day. The cause of the blow at that time wasn't known, and there were many theories flying around. I have since brought my engine to WTF Auto for a rebuild, and as of late last week, my engine is finally out and is in the process of being rebuilt.

This thread is a blog of the rebuild process, including comments from the engine builder, my comments on things past, present and future, and hopefully some interesting photos. Feel free to comment in this thread, but lets not go too far off track:

-- Brendan
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    levos1
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 09:46:51 (permalink)
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    WOW !
    This is awesome dude! heheh!!!
    #2
    MR2Vaeth
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 10:01:56 (permalink)
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    Entry 1:

    Excerpt of an email from Tristan
    quote:

    Hey Brendan,

    Almost everything has been smooth so far. Although the rear driveshafts" welded" themselves into the hubs from rust which is very uncharacteristic of your extremely tidy car. I have a feeling that the missing centre caps combined with salt water on the trip over must have caused the problem.

    Your head has copped a bit of damage, something foreign went through the inlet and started punching holes in cyl 3. Im going to have to have some of the damage welded up I think. The piston was a bit damaged too - not that it matters.

    The Mahle pistons have arrived also - They're an incredibly nice piece. And they are the lightest piston/pin combination Ive come across.

    I'd like to take a bit of time to tidy some bits of your motor up. A lot of things have been done 'rushed' such as the fuel rail install - instead of running a new return line, the stock half metal line
    is just hanging around, scratching up your sard rail... and a couple more things here and there.

    Anyway, I'll shoot you another email once I've examined the pistons

    -Tristan



    It was good hearing from Tristan that my car was in overall very good condition. It is a pity that my driveshafts have rust locked, but well, that's fix-able so I'm not too worried. The bit about the rushed job regarding my fuel rail installation really urks me though. This begins the first of many grievances against the workshop that did my fuel rail installation and tuning.

    The work shop that did my fuel rail installation, cams installation, and tuning was called TRIAL. They are a workshop in Osaka, Japan, and are also listed as a workshop in Gran Turismo 4. It should at this point be stated for the record that any further comment I make about TRIAL will be strictly a relation of my personal experiences with them, and my personal view of them resulting from my experiences with them. At no point should my comments be understood as a statement of fact of their business practices, conduct, quality, and so forth. It is not a purpose of my comments regarding TRIAL to affect people's perception of them, nor to affect their reputation. I am merely relating my own experience in dealing with them.

    I went to TRIAL thinking that, well, yes, they are exorbitant, but at least I know I'm getting the best. After all, it's no small feat to be featured in GT4 right? Not to mention they used to be a sponsor in JGTC and some other races like that. Having paid close to $4000 for my cams, fuel rail, and tuning, it just pisses me off to hear that they didn't even bother fitting a new return line and instead left the stock one just hanging around like it is...anyway. Deep breath, ring bell, meditate.

    On to the damaged head. This kinda got me down. From the sound of things, my engine was in pristine condition (see further blog entries later below). It's somewhat disapponting to hear that I damaged it. I'm not sure when this happened so no fingers being pointed anywhere here. I feel like I've ruined a famous painting though...like the Mona Lisa or something. Even if it can be fixed, it's not the same.

    Anyway...now the Mahle pistons sound cool. I'm really excited about these. I've always like using something different from the norm, and to be able to test out something new as opposed to using the normal JE, Arias, etc pistons, just puts a smile on my face. Not that I'd notice the difference anyway...but well, that's my way of ricing up my car.

    End Entry #1
    #3

    MR2Vaeth
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 10:10:34 (permalink)
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    Entry 2:

    I gotta say, I was a bit worried about the head. I wanted things perfect. Tristan recommended fixing the pock marks using "welds". Not exactly sure what that means, but I trust him that they will hold up against the abuse I will throwing at it, and will not affect performance too badly. Nonetheless, I seriously considered trying to source a 'new' 2nd hand head from Japan.

    Oh, I should also mention that by using "welds", the head would have to be re-machined. This will be the 2nd time the head's been re-machined, and Tristan did mention that the compression ratio would be beginning to creep up. He actually managed to come back to me with an exact compression ratio! LOL, that's amazing. Anyway, the new CR after the 2nd re-machining will be 8.95:1 as opposed to the stock 8.5:1.

    I spoke to Jay and Luan about this and thankfully, they managed to knock some sense into me. Thanks guys! [^] As was pointed out, there's no guarantee that the 2nd hand head will be in any better condition. Also a slightly higher CR may not necessary be a bad thing. It might make my car 'punchier' apparently, which sounds good for a circuit car in the hands of a $hit driver. [B)] If anyone has had any experience with High CR turbo cars, please chime it here with your experiences and views. Thanks.

    So yeah, anyway, wrote back to Tristan and said to basically just go with the welds. Still...can't shake the feeling that I've ruined a pristine engine. Grrr.[:(!]

    End Entry #2

    #4
    RobYob
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 10:15:30 (permalink)
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    Great idea Brendan, thanks for sharing the experience.
    #5
    MR2Vaeth
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 10:17:53 (permalink)
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    Entry 3:

    Excerpt of Email from Tristan (regarding damage to the head):
    quote:

    The damage is big enough to be caused by something like a small chunk of welding flash .. for example, a bit of metal loose inside the intercooler when it was installed. A chunk of compressor from a failed turbo can do it too.. or just a plain old fashioned chunk of debris in the intake pipes/manifold/combustion chamber. Small beads of metal often find their way into unusual places if welding is happening nearby... and this contamination could have occurred when the head was off the car.

    The fact that it happened to only one cylinder means there was probably only 1 object involved. Typically, a filter failure will cause problems across many cylinders.

    The size of the object was probably about that of the small screws that hold glasses (spectacles) together. Big enough to make some nasty marks when the piston is bouncing up and down 100 times a second but not big enough to render the head completely useless.

    To keep it happening again, its quite simple. Build a clean engine and if intake parts come off, thoroughly clean and blow them out before refitting.



    There you go guys and gals, tips for installing any mods that are part of the intake tract. Be careful! Be it airfilter, turbo, pipes, intercooler, manifold, etc, make sure nothing gets in there, and blow them out before refitting!

    Nothing is ever as simple as it looks, even installing a simple air filter. Problem is, bringing it to a 'reputed' mechanic doesn't guarantee it's done right either. Solution? Do it yourself? Go by word-of-mouth to find a good mechanic? I really don't know...and I'll be having the same problem once my car is back in Syd, and I need someone to install stuff for me. Suggestions?

    End Entry #3
    #6

    MR2Vaeth
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 10:30:07 (permalink)
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    Entry #4

    Excerpt of Email from Tristan (revised for readability by me):
    quote:

    Well, the teardown is complete. Pistons 1,2 and 3 have smashed ring
    lands. Given that #4, the richest cylinder survived, I'd guess that
    the failure was from lean AFRs.

    Pison #2 was particularly destroyed...the second ring land got smashed too, something I've not seen before on a 3S piston that wasn't melted. The top rod bearings all have wear spots where the detonation has literally hammered the rod into the crank at TDC over a pretty prolonged period (ie, longer than a few seconds). Your rod small end bushes have also been knocked out of round and -should- be replaced.

    Otherwise your whole engine is in amazing condition. Oil pump is the
    newest looking example Ive ever seen, bearings and pistons are
    superb. This motor could have done 300,000kms plus if treated like it
    has been (aside from the smashed pistons!)

    On that topic, how many kms had the motor done when you got the car?
    what oil have you used and how often did you change it? Im very very
    interested to know.

    -Tristan



    So...bad AFR's blew my engine? I understand that this is just an opinion of one engine builder, but his reasoning and justification behind his conclusion is hard to refute.

    Pistons 1 - 3 are dead. The traditionally richest piston #4 is still surviving. Amazing to think that I still manage to drive my car home from the track in this condition. I was basically running on 1 good piston, 2 half pistons, and 1 truly dead piston? Talk about tough.

    Anyway, I hate to point more fingers, but I'd have to say that I'm definitely pointing in the direction of TRIAL regarding the cause of my blown engine. They were the ones who tuned my engine in the first place. I am so glad that I did not go back to them to rebuild my engine. I can't help but wonder how lean the AFR was to cause 3 pistons to blow a ring. And to cause one of the pistons to blow 2 rings. Damn... Oh, I should also mention that when TRIAL did a check of my car to ascertain the damage (and how to fix it), they only mentioned that piston #2 (or #3 i forgot) was blown. They didn't menion that pistons #1 and #3 were also blown. Gees...thanks very much Murayama-san...you da man.

    Deep breath, ring bell, meditate....grrrr!!!

    Anyway, glad to hear more confirmation that the rest of my engine is in good nick. Gotta say a big thank you to the previous (and only) owner of my MR2 for taking such care of the car. Sorry I've blow it up...but I'll take good care of it from now on!

    End Entry #4
    #7
    MR2Vaeth
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 10:35:54 (permalink)
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    Entry #5

    Excerpt of Email from Tristan:
    quote:

    The cylinder walls are in good condition, the piston damage doesn't seem to have caused any wall damage. Not that it matters any now that we're overboring by 0.5mm. And the crank still looks pretty superb except for some minor wear from contact with the bearings.

    Two or three oil change lapses (15,000+ kms between each oil change) consecutively is usually enough to permenantly gunk up the engine.. or the use of mineral oil for that matter.

    I'm pretty confident that your motor has seen nothing but high grade synthetics its entire life. Most 100,000km 3sgtes I get look internally like the inside of an oven after 5 years of zero cleaning.
    Partially because Toyota use full mineral oil from factory, and partially because people don’t seem to believe in regular services.

    Even the rods,pistons and crank are so spotless, its amazing. Even on engines that have been serviced well, the internal parts are usually stained a brownish colour. No sign of that in yours. Its obviously used some high detergency oil all its life and any build up of gunk when you missed that service most likely washed away with the following oil change.

    Anyway, I trust you'll be motivated to continue good care of the new motor
    :)



    There you go, oils ain't oils. Use only the best full-synth oils for your engine if you care about it.
    #8
    MR2Vaeth
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 10:40:00 (permalink)
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    Entry #6

    Cracked Piston


    Cracked Piston



    Cracked Piston



    Cracked Piston



    Mahle v. Stock



    Big end bearing wear



    Hmmm...hope my crankshaft is alright. That looks like a nasty wear mark.


    End Entry #6
    post edited by MR2Vaeth - 2016/12/31 00:23:25
    #9
    70YMR
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 11:28:24 (permalink)
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    Thats an awesome run down so far Brendan, awesome stuff!! Look forward to future entries!

    Hayley
    #10
    mjbro10
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 12:13:24 (permalink)
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    as the compression ratio is just the ratio of the maximum volume formed in the cylinder to the minimum(clearance) volume, increasing it would have to produce more mechanical energy and a better thermal efficiency. Someone confirm?
    #11
    MR2Vaeth
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 12:36:43 (permalink)
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    mjbro: Yes, that is correct. However, it also reduces your ability to "add more boost" since the mixture in a higher compression engine is under a greater pressure than a mixture in a lower compression engine. A higher compression gives more torque (I believe), but will cause you to detonate at less boost (i.e. less air).
    #12
    KrAzE
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 13:06:25 (permalink)
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    quote:
    Originally posted by MR2Vaeth
    There you go, oils ain't oils. Use only the best full-synth oils for your engine if you care about it.



    hmmm, VERY different from what Terry at Road and Track said on this issue. He said that the 3sgte doesn't like fully synthetic oil, and that people should only be using semi-synthetic oil, as the Synthetic stuff is too good for it...
    #13
    hotmr2
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 13:06:46 (permalink)
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    very interesting read. come on coming mate!
    #14
    MR2Vaeth
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    RE: Vaeth's Rebuild Blog 2006/04/10 15:46:11 (permalink)
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    quote:
    Originally posted by KrAzE

    quote:
    Originally posted by MR2Vaeth
    There you go, oils ain't oils. Use only the best full-synth oils for your engine if you care about it.



    hmmm, VERY different from what Terry at Road and Track said on this issue. He said that the 3sgte doesn't like fully synthetic oil, and that people should only be using semi-synthetic oil, as the Synthetic stuff is too good for it...



    I'd have to say that the proof is in the pudding Kraze. Or in this case, the proof is in the lack of pudding in my opened engine.

    Only possibility I can think of of why a semi-synth would be better than a full-synth is in circumstances/situations where the engine is already not in perfect shape (i.e. it has not been service regularly, and/or has been using mineral or semi-synth oil for a while) and putting in full-synth just highlights and brings out the problems already present. A semi-synth or non-synth in this case would hide the problems and makes the engine seem smoother.

    That's my guess anyway.
    #15
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