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94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel

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2014/07/13 11:03:05 (permalink)
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94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel

Hey guys,
 
About 8 months ago, I posted about having some issues with my brake upgrade. Calipers locking on and overheating and whatnot.
Since then, I've discovered that it was due to a) my ABS playing up, which will be removed fairly soon, and b) my right-rear caliper being seized and needing a rebuild.
 
Since then, I went to Wakefield park and tracked the car for the first time. While I was there, I noticed that once you get up to speed (~120k's or so), when you try braking, the pedal is totally solid for about half a second, before it gives way and the brakes start to work. Anyone who has Gen 3 brakes will know that there's a bit of a dead zone before the brakes bite. This only happens when braking from high speeds. While daily driving, I have no problems, but since running semi-slick tyres on weekends, I've been noticing this while in the hills as well.
 
There was a thread I was linked to a couple of months ago indicating that it's a check valve issue, but that didn't really help, since I don't know what the difference is between Gen 2 and 3 chassis regarding the brake booster operation.
 
I have a Gen 3 Bathurst wreck in the back yard, which will still have all the parts I'd need to fix this issue, I just need to know what needs to be changed, and the repair manuals are telling me nothing.
 
tl;dr, apparently I have a check valve issue. How do I find out what the difference is between the old brake booster and the new one?
 
Thanks guys!

Current: 1992 SW20 MR2 GT-S
1997 BMW 318ti Rally car/Lemons car?
Daily: 2017 Subaru WRX
Tow Car: 2011 Ford Falcon FG XR6
 
Previous: 1999 AE101 Corolla
1986 AE82 Corolla
1991 SW20 MR2 Mongrel
1991 Nissan S13 Silvia
1982 Nissan 280ZX
#1


8 Replies Related Threads

    Reddtarga
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    Re: 94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel 2014/07/13 17:12:25 (permalink)
    +1 (1)
    You can see from the pics that the booster hose connections are different.
    The first, a '90 model has the check valve on the booster assembly (a bit hard to see from the pic), but the second, a '92+ one has no check valve on the actual booster. All the later model boosters are like this and if you have one of them fitted you'll need the check valve back in the engine bay coming off the intake manifold.
     
    The genuine Toyota part is expensive, however other cheaper ones can be used.
    They will need 10 mm hose connections like the Honda Accura one (see last pic)  that works fine on my car and can easily be inserted into the existing hose.
     
    With no vacuum check valve fitted the brakes can take a couple of seconds to activate before anything happens. (A scary experience !!)
    What also happens is that by the time the brakes come on, you are pressing so hard on the pedal that the ABS activates. (Another scary experience !!)
    With the check valve fitted none of that should happen and braking should be instantaneous.
     


     

     
    post edited by Reddtarga - 2014/07/13 17:27:07

    1990 ADM NA
     
     
     
     
     
     
    #2
    Randomity
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    Re: 94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel 2014/07/13 17:25:56 (permalink)
    0
    Right, so if I check through the Gen 3 chassis along the line the booster runs off, I should find the check valve that runs off the manifold pressure? The engine has since gone in my car, but that line is still running the length of the car.
     
    Thanks for the help!

    Current: 1992 SW20 MR2 GT-S
    1997 BMW 318ti Rally car/Lemons car?
    Daily: 2017 Subaru WRX
    Tow Car: 2011 Ford Falcon FG XR6
     
    Previous: 1999 AE101 Corolla
    1986 AE82 Corolla
    1991 SW20 MR2 Mongrel
    1991 Nissan S13 Silvia
    1982 Nissan 280ZX
    #3

    Reddtarga
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    Re: 94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel 2014/07/13 17:30:42 (permalink)
    0
    From the parts catalog the pic shows a length of pipe connected to a bit of hose that connects to the intake manifold.
     
    BTW, just curious, do you have an early booster?

    1990 ADM NA
     
     
     
     
     
     
    #4
    Randomity
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    Re: 94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel 2014/07/13 17:41:46 (permalink)
    0
    I have both boosters. I've got the '91 one sitting in a cabinet, and the '94 one on the car at the moment, along with the rest of the brake setup.
     
    I just went out and inspected both engine bays. I noticed one difference between the two lines. The photo is of the Gen 3. That rubber line isn't on the Gen 2 line at all. It's solid all the way around.
     
    Is this what I'd need to put on my car?

    Current: 1992 SW20 MR2 GT-S
    1997 BMW 318ti Rally car/Lemons car?
    Daily: 2017 Subaru WRX
    Tow Car: 2011 Ford Falcon FG XR6
     
    Previous: 1999 AE101 Corolla
    1986 AE82 Corolla
    1991 SW20 MR2 Mongrel
    1991 Nissan S13 Silvia
    1982 Nissan 280ZX
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    dasic1
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    Re: 94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel 2014/07/13 18:49:57 (permalink)
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    yes that is it 
    #6

    Randomity
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    Re: 94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel 2014/07/13 18:54:01 (permalink)
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    Awesome! Good to know that's an easily fixed problem now.
     
    Thanks guys!

    Current: 1992 SW20 MR2 GT-S
    1997 BMW 318ti Rally car/Lemons car?
    Daily: 2017 Subaru WRX
    Tow Car: 2011 Ford Falcon FG XR6
     
    Previous: 1999 AE101 Corolla
    1986 AE82 Corolla
    1991 SW20 MR2 Mongrel
    1991 Nissan S13 Silvia
    1982 Nissan 280ZX
    #7
    Reddtarga
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    Re: 94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel 2014/07/13 19:04:15 (permalink)
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    Wow using a later model booster without a check valve!!
    and with bigger brakes too!!
    As is said before, scary.
     
     

    1990 ADM NA
     
     
     
     
     
     
    #8
    Randomity
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    Re: 94+ Brake upgrade pedal feel 2014/07/13 19:09:50 (permalink)
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    It's not an issue until you start slamming them on from high speeds. They work just fine until you're heading into a hairpin from a long straight, or similar.
    Less then fun, though. I'll admit. Glad to have this issue fixed.
    Or at least close to.

    Current: 1992 SW20 MR2 GT-S
    1997 BMW 318ti Rally car/Lemons car?
    Daily: 2017 Subaru WRX
    Tow Car: 2011 Ford Falcon FG XR6
     
    Previous: 1999 AE101 Corolla
    1986 AE82 Corolla
    1991 SW20 MR2 Mongrel
    1991 Nissan S13 Silvia
    1982 Nissan 280ZX
    #9
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