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3RZFE into SW20

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Nik_Lee
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2014/04/11 09:14:14 (permalink)
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3RZFE into SW20

Hi everyone
 
Just had a little idea kicking around and was curious if anyone has done it or how much work would be involved to do it.
The 3RZFE is 2.7L in capacity it has a bore and stroke of 95 x 95 and chain driven double overhead cam I have seen this engine dropped into a few other cars like corollas and even a couple of Nissan Silvia's, turbocharged producing some very healthy numbers. I was thinking with its capacity it should give quite good torque and the ability run slightly larger turbos without having as much lag as you would running the same size turbo on a 2L
 
This post is just out of my own curiosity really.

Current ride, 2010 TT RS
Previous ride, 1994 JDM MR2 Turbo hardtop
http://www.mr2australia.c..r2play/tm.aspx?m=105959
 
#1


18 Replies Related Threads

    ashtwo
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/18 15:59:49 (permalink)
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    Why would you want to do that? It would not be worth the work for an extra 700cc, if you're unhappy with torque change your turbo. If you're still unhappy get a 2grfe
    #2
    Gatesys SW20
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/19 11:42:55 (permalink)
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    Ashtwo- if you have nothing good to contribute to the question please refrain from interjecting.

    We are here to help with questions and debate the topic not shoot it down without a decent thought.
    I for one would like to see the pros and cons of this topic.
    Just because it hasnt been done or heard of much before does not mean its a bad idea.
    Im sure when the first person said. 'Lets put a 2gr in how much work would that be'?
    Everyone flamed him- but look at the idea now..

    This is an interesting idea- would love to see someone knowledgeble on this comment.

    Waiting on Aaron, Cam and Toten to comment :P
    #3

    MR2QIK
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/19 13:01:19 (permalink)
    +1 (1)
    No matter how you look at it, if doing a v6 engine conversion, 2GR is the ultimate. 3RZ may be an ok engine, but for the work involved, 2GR is the logical choice. More torque & displacement from a 3.5L. In turbo guise, 2JZ 4-figure potential.

    Engine conversions are good & all, but I'm a purist with the 3S/MR2.

    MR2QIK - "The Little Car That Could"



    320rwkw @ 19psi (pump fuel, no giggle gas)
    11.96 @ 116mph (with 228rwkw)
    #4
    cogs
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/19 17:15:56 (permalink)
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    I think it's a bit too agricultural for an MR2, and probably a good deal heavier than other more practical options.  Are 3RZs even used in transverse configuration?  It'd probably be a lot more work than it's worth.
     
    If going to that much trouble, I'd rather see something a little more unique like a high performance diesel.

    1990 SW20 GT
    #5
    dennis the menace
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/19 21:17:44 (permalink)
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    A quick google search suggests that the 3rz is around 170kgs, and the 2grs are around 60 kgs less.

    Past-President, MR2 Owners Club Qld
    "There is a fine line between hobby and obsession."
    #6

    Knightrous
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/19 22:34:31 (permalink)
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    It could be an interesting build from a few perspectives. The 3RZ has been pretty popular in the drag world where I believe for a while it was the highest HP producing boosted 4 cylinder motor (or one of the highest). As mentioned, a lot of work for if your doing just chasing a mild upgrade over the regular 3SGTE.
     
    IMO, if your looking for something different while chasing more torque and less lag to achieve more HP, you should have a good look at the Toyota 2AR-FE motor with a Turbo bolted on. These are a 2.5L, all alloy motor with VVTI and regularly get modified in the Scion Tc. There are a few off the shelf kits supporting up to 500hp which takes the hassle of piecing out a build plan. The other good thing is you can get the EA60 6 speed manual gearbox, which has been adapted to MR2's previously.
     
    Alternatively, grab a cheap 1MZFE, drop some forged pistons in it (maybe some rods too if your going 500+HP), wire up an aftermarket computer, slap on a GT35 class turbo and make more HP and Torque then any 3SGTE anywhere in the rev range.
    #7
    B24
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/19 23:00:19 (permalink)
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    One thing to consider with putting a boosted V6 with more weight than the 3SGTE in NA form is weight transfer.
    Its all great to stick a high revving 500hp engine in the back of the car but when you start adding some spirited driving to the package you will be in the 'danger zone' of loss of control far quicker than other options.
     
    An example: After driving a 2GR-FE at Marulan driving centre on Monday, one of the biggest differences with the 3SGTE package is the weight transfer or lack of. This engine is at least 20kg lighter the mine and its very noticeable on the limit. It simply did not 'pitch' to the degree of my 3SGTE does. Far easier to tame so easier to control but I fear this could be a different scenario with an iron block in a MR2.
    Lighter is better in these cars.
    A boosted 1MZ or 2AR (Knightrous) or 2GRFE Supercharged would be a wiser option. BTW, the 2GR is capable of 500+hp at 6200rpm on low boost when prepared by the right people.
    You will also need a E153 gearbox and decent axle cages.
    Whatever way you go, we are all here to help.  
    #8
    Mrskylighter
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/19 23:11:38 (permalink)
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    Another lightweight engine that bolts in (with a Hux Racing mount kit) is a Honda K20 (2.0L) or K24 (2.4L). Hang a turbo off the side and away you go :)
    #9
    Nik_Lee
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/29 07:14:22 (permalink)
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    Thanks for all the input guys.
     
    I just thought I would ask the question to get ideas so it is good that a few different ideas have been posted, thank you.
     
    I have to admit when I bought my MR2 I purposely went looking for a 94 JDM because I wanted the gen3 turbo and all other updates that the 94's got, at that time I did not realize that the 3SGTE had the weakness in the block when pushed a bit harder which is disappointing. So that is why I started to wonder what options there might be out there because if I was to look at changing engines to gain a more reliable engine than why not look at options that will give you added gains at the same time and what got me curious about the 3RZ was the fact I had seen these push big numbers reliably and I also have a 3RZ bottom end sitting at my parents place.
    But I do have to admit that I would prefer an alloy engine over a cast engine as it would be nice to loose some weight from the rear of the car and I would prefer to stick with a 4cyl over a 6cyl mainly just because I'm more of a 4cyl fan and love the idea of hypo 4cly's sticking it to their bigger engined cousins.
     
    I do like the sound of the 2AR-FE that Knightrous suggested and I also like the idea of being able to run a EA60 6 speed with it! Out of curiosity which box would be stronger the EA60 or the 5 speed that is already behind my turbo?

    Current ride, 2010 TT RS
    Previous ride, 1994 JDM MR2 Turbo hardtop
    http://www.mr2australia.c..r2play/tm.aspx?m=105959
     
    #10
    Knightrous
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/29 08:36:40 (permalink)
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    Nik_Lee
    I do like the sound of the 2AR-FE that Knightrous suggested and I also like the idea of being able to run a EA60 6 speed with it! Out of curiosity which box would be stronger the EA60 or the 5 speed that is already behind my turbo?



    Paul Woods from TwoBrutal has stripped down both the EA/EB and E series boxes and rates them as having a similar capability as the E153.
    #11
    MCT_MR2
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/29 11:22:26 (permalink)
    +2 (2)
    While looking at alloy camry engines like the 2ar, you could also consider the 2azfe. Plenty common due to them being used in 2 series of camrys, as well as rav 4's, there are plenty of parts for them available, you can buy stroker kits, sleeves, even 1000hp crate bottom ends for them. Not as advanced as the 2ar, but a lot cheaper.

    '88 MR2 4AGTE W/ EFR6258

    224.6KW @ 20PSI

    more to come......
    #12
    Mrskylighter
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/29 14:13:37 (permalink)
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    Nik, is your car a genuine Gen3 Hardtop turbo import? If it is, do you really wanna do an engine conversion on it? They are quite rare as it is.
     
    I wouldn't say the Gen3 3sgte block is weak, its just not as strong as a gen2 3sgte or 5sfe etc. You can still get big power from them. How much HP are you aiming for in this car?
    #13
    Nik_Lee
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/29 14:30:11 (permalink)
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    Yes my car is a genuine Gen3 hardtop turbo import and I did look for quite a while to find one that ticked all those boxes, preferably I would like to be able to just stick with the gen3 3S but I don't want to go building a strong engine and have the block fail once it is under a bit more stress.
     
    To be honest I would love to eventually get the car somewhere around 300rwkw.

    Current ride, 2010 TT RS
    Previous ride, 1994 JDM MR2 Turbo hardtop
    http://www.mr2australia.c..r2play/tm.aspx?m=105959
     
    #14
    Mrskylighter
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    Re: 3RZFE into SW20 2014/04/29 14:45:26 (permalink)
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    If your goal is 300rwkw then all you need to do is build up a 5sfe block (rods + pistons) and swap over the gen3 head and oiling system. Then you end up with a strong block with capacity increased to 2.2L
    No need to do an engine conversion for 300kw. Unless you want the low end torque of a V6 with 300kw :) 
    #15
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