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Helpful ReplyRe-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 *Now with pictures*

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Mrskylighter
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 15:07:27 (permalink)
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I am designing a little circuit using a 5 pin relay that should fix this for you. Can you confirm that the ecu is switching the 12v in the a/c plug or is it switching the Neg?
Another way of asking, is it the 12v or the Neg (ground) always at the plug regardless of whether the a/c is on or off?
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Mrskylighter
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 15:27:55 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Senor_2 2014/01/23 16:27:37
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Use this type of relay and the diagram pictured a few posts below.

 
 
post edited by Mrskylighter - 2014/01/23 18:36:43
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MIDN1T3
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 16:27:31 (permalink)
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Mrskylighter
I am designing a little circuit using a 5 pin relay that should fix this for you. Can you confirm that the ecu is switching the 12v in the a/c plug or is it switching the Neg?
Another way of asking, is it the 12v or the Neg (ground) always at the plug regardless of whether the a/c is on or off?

Ok, so just re-checked with a circuit tester, and there is 12v at the plug when the AC is off. When the AC is on, there no 12v at the plug.
So it's pretty much reverse of what it should be by my understanding?

1990 SW20 MR2 N/A with 1994 Gen 3 GTS 3S-GTE swap.

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MIDN1T3
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 16:40:12 (permalink)
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Mrskylighter
Here is a little circuit which will work if its the 12v being switched in the plug. excuse my messy scribble.
Basically how it works is you have a normally closed relay supplying 12v to the a/c idle valve all the time whilst the ignition is on.
  • When the A/C is switched off inside the car the ecu is sending 12v to the relay coil which stops the 12v being sent to the valve. (normal idle speed)
  • When you switch the a/c on inside the car the ecu stops sending the 12v and the coil goes back to the normally closed position which sends 12v to the valve (which increases the idle speed)
Disregard where I have written blue a/c plug on my drawing. Its actually black :)
 
Maybe someone else would like to confirm that the below will work?
 

 
Use one of these below for the relay.

 
 

Awesome, thanks mate. I've just noticed something else... The two wires leading into the AC vsv plug are black and red, however current seems to be coming out of the black wire when the AC is off(I grabbed earth from another earth lead). Shouldn't it be coming out of the red wire?

1990 SW20 MR2 N/A with 1994 Gen 3 GTS 3S-GTE swap.

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Mrskylighter
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 16:41:43 (permalink)
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Are you measuring 12v using the pos + neg on the plug? Or are you measuring the 12v to the car body for example?
We need to prove that its the 12v pin being switched or the Neg/ground pin.
 
But yes it is the wrong way around.
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Mrskylighter
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 16:44:54 (permalink)
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No idea about what colour wires do what sorry. The BGB electrical section will tell you though. I wouldn't worry too much about the colour of the wire.
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 16:48:36 (permalink)
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So just to confirm:
  • With the AC switched off
    • There is continuity between the Neg pin on the plug and the car body?
    • There is 12v at the positive pin on the plug?
  • With the AC switched on
    • There is continuity between the Neg pin on the plug and the car body?
    • There is no 12v at the positive pin on the plug?
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MIDN1T3
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 17:33:26 (permalink)
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Mrskylighter
So just to confirm:
  • With the AC switched off
    • There is continuity between the Neg pin on the plug and the car body?
    • There is 12v at the positive pin on the plug?
  • With the AC switched on
    • There is continuity between the Neg pin on the plug and the car body?
    • There is no 12v at the positive pin on the plug?



Nope, other way around.
AC off: there is continuity at the neg, and there is 12v at the plug.
AC on: there is no continuity at the neg, and there is 12v at the plug.
In other words, there is always power at the plug, the ground gets switched.
Sorry, I should have explained that more clearly before.

1990 SW20 MR2 N/A with 1994 Gen 3 GTS 3S-GTE swap.

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Mrskylighter
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 18:03:42 (permalink)
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Okay cool. In that case the diagram I provided earlier will not work. I'll put together another one tonight for you.
post edited by Mrskylighter - 2014/01/23 18:37:39
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 18:33:23 (permalink)
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Okay this circuit diagram is the one you want to reverse the neg/ground at the A/C idle up valve.
 
Once again happy for someone to critique my design to confirm it works or simplify it.
 

 
So with the a/c switched off in the car the neg/ground will not be sent to the a/c valve as the relay will be energised.
With the a/c on the relay will not be energised. As a result of the normally closed relay the neg/ground will be sent to the a/c valve which will cause it to operate.
 
I will delete the earlier diagram so as not to confuse anyone who finds the thread in the future.
 
 
 
 
#40
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 22:42:02 (permalink)
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Thanks Nick, you are a legend. Really appreciate it.
Last question, when you had this same problem (AC idle up) on your car (and I'm guessing you did a conversion too), was it due to the conversion to gen 3 3sgte and not the AC amplifier?
Just making sure it's not worth my while having a look at the AC amplifier.

1990 SW20 MR2 N/A with 1994 Gen 3 GTS 3S-GTE swap.

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Mrskylighter
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 22:51:24 (permalink)
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i believe the reason it happens is because the a/c amp in the early models puts out a different signal than the a/c amp in the later cars. 
its the a/c amp that tells the ecu that he a/c is on via a/c pin on the ecu harness. 
 
if you build the cheap relay above you will be sorted. this idle issue is not due to a fault, just a difference in electronics.
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artymr2
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 23:14:56 (permalink)
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Have the same idle issue after the gen3 swap, have not gotten around to sort it. I understand it's the signal in the gen3 that the ecu receives is reversed. Is it worth applying a similar fix above to the trigger wire to the ecu instead of the valve itself? I guess the final outcome will be the same.

Cheers

Black SW20 GT Turbo T-top


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Mrskylighter
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/23 23:26:02 (permalink)
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Yep you can do the fix at the ecu harness instead. That's where I did it on mine.

You just need to decide where you are going to chop into the wiring.
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Re: Re-routing AC Idle up vacuum hose Gen 3 2014/01/24 00:02:27 (permalink)
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Sweet. Well then good to know the AC guys didn't stuff things up. Hopefully I've got some time tomorrow to give this a go. Chopping into the wiring is going to be the hard part haha

1990 SW20 MR2 N/A with 1994 Gen 3 GTS 3S-GTE swap.

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