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Originally posted by Senol

Wasn't the stroker kit like $5000? I think a n/a build with max hp in mind would cost around $20000?

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for the most budget NA stroker you'd just fit a 5sfe crank/block, maybe the 5s rods would be ok and then custom high CR piston's to suit.

so could get away with basic block prep and just the cost of forged piston's(and no you cant use stock gen3 3s piston's with the 5S crank)

tho for a high revving NA you'd need forged rods as well.

but in all honesty NA's want to rev and the 3s crank will be better for high rpm, less bore side wall forces etc.

well it depends on the dyno you use i guess.

i think i have a dyno chart somewhere of a redtop BEAM's with CAM's and forged rods/piston's quads and HKS extractors. can't remeber ATWKW, but i think it was around 175.

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Originally posted by surok

CAI does poo poo all.
gen 2 makes less than gen 3
exhaust would have to be a race exhaust. not some street legal thing with mufflers
ITBs will help response
264 cams wont be enough
you will need a programmable ecu
then you will make good power around 8500

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Ive just been referring to Terry from Road and Track's "3S-GE pdf" He says you can go up to 270 on the standard ecu, (he notes you would notice the gains more with a programmable ecu). Even a street legal exhaust is going to give more kw to the wheels than the standard exhaust. And as for the CAI it makes a difference.. but so small its negligible, I think it sounds good, I like intake noise.

At the end of the day it really depends on how much you want to gain. I'm not looking for max hp. I just want the car to feel more spirited in the higher rev range, but still remain street drivable.

The GenIII makes the 125-127 kw at 7000rpm instead of the Gen II's 117kw at 6600rpm. Can you really notice the difference between them? I think i would.. but i seem to notice small changes.

The work his thinking of doing would give much more power to his GENII then what a stock standard genIII right? A genIII swap would also cost a lot more.

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Originally posted by surok

my gen 3 outruns gen 2s in a straight line.. but mine probably weighs less too.

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Factory 1/4 mile times for both are the same. 15.7s (I got 15.84s)
I think at this age wear and tear would have to be considered, among things like driver ability.

I don't know about your car being lighter unless you did some weight reduction yourself. Isn't yours the full package, targa+airbags+leather seats etc?

What would you have to do to a GEN2 N/A to get about 115kw at the wheels?

im a bit dubious about getting an aftermarket ecu without big modifications on the motor(i was under the impression the standard ecu once reset can adjust air fuel mixtures accordingly). I'm thinking can i get there for say shy of "$1100" just parts cost? lets say ive already got the exhaust system and assume its descent.. I know cams and valve springs can be had for that budget. What else besides from cams can you do for around that price?

I'm only continuing this discussion here because i believe the author would want these questions answered too.

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Originally posted by artymr2

Many moons ago when we had a club dyno day, these were the results (kw at the wheels)

SW20 Gen3 NA stock 93
AW11 NA stock 57
AW11 NA with muffler 59
SW20 Gen2 turbo stock 119
SW20 Gen2 turbo free flow exhaust 1bar boost 140
SW20 Gen3 turbo muffler 126

from memory, smokeys NA SW20 Gen2 on another day on the same dyno made slightly less than the Gen3 NA, but he had custom extractors, free flow exhaust, free flow intake, tuned for 98 (advanced timing). We all thought it would make more than the Gen3 considering the mods it had.

Cheers

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Thanks thats some useful information. Was that dyno reading low? Or is that normal? My brother had his car dyno'd once at one place and got 140hp and again at rotary motorsports and got 115hp. thats a pretty big difference. I guess it supports getting your car tuned at one place and one place only.

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Originally posted by just_ace

well it depends on the dyno you use i guess.

i think i have a dyno chart somewhere of a redtop BEAM's with CAM's and forged rods/piston's quads and HKS extractors. can't remeber ATWKW, but i think it was around 175.

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I know of two Victorian club race cars that run a mismash of blacktop/redtop BEAM's motors, one is a 2.2, and the other a stock 2l, and are both in the 185rwkw region at 9800rpm. These motors are far from streetable, the exhaust runners are long enough that they would not be practical in a east-west engine config.